by Colin Whitby
This is the most popular interview we have published. I was very fortunate to catch up with Pamela Kribbe after reading what was for me the most inspiring channeling, The Jeshua Channelings. Her work is available for free on her web site Jeshua.net, or your can purchase a copy of her book The Jeshua Channelings to read at your leisure (my preferred method). I do hope you enjoy the interview.
How did your spiritual awakening start, and how were you to lead towards self expression and a more heart focused approach to life?
My awakening started when my heart was broken because of a love affair. At 26, I was pursuing an academic career and I was writing a PhD thesis on modern philosophy of science. I was enmeshed in a very rational approach of life and was married to a scientist. Then I met someone who was a philosopher also and who I had amazing conversations with about metaphysics and spirituality. I had always been interested in spirituality and the esoteric, but I had been suppressing this for quite a while. I fell deeply in love with this man and I thought he was the love of my life. However, things turned out differently.
While I got divorced, he decided to go back to his girlfriend. I felt shattered by this experience and suddenly, my fascination for academic philosophy completely disappeared. I was so devastated emotionally and so thirsty for real knowledge - the kind that speaks to your heart - that I was completely finished with intellectualism. I completed my thesis in 1997, but I left the university and started to read a lot of spiritual and esoteric literature. In 2000, I met a woman who was a spiritual teacher and psychic reader, and meeting her was the beginning of a deep inner transformation. She helped me become aware of old emotion pain, pain that stemmed from my early childhood as well as multiple past lives which I started to remember. With her help I relived these painful emotions and was able to rise above them. I felt liberated and free for the first time in my life. It was like I had died and been reborn as a new person, but at the same it felt like I could finally be myself.
Immediately after I went through this period of catharsis and liberation, I met Gerrit (my husband) in 2001. I stumbled upon his website on spirituality and reincarnation on the Internet and we started a lively correspondence. Connecting to him felt miraculous. There was a kinship between us which was unexplainable and yet so familiar. Unlike the devastating love affair in the past, our coming together was not surrounded by drama, but by a deeply joyful, quiet knowing that we belonged together. Gerrit had always been deeply interested in the esoteric and it was only natural for us to start working together as spiritual therapists. After our daughter was born in 2002, we built up our own practice and I could do what my heart most longed to do: to work as an energy reader and teacher and to explore philosophical questions about life in a meaningful, practical way.
How did you come to learn about channelling and when were you first drawn to it?
I got acquainted with channeling around 1995, by reading the work of Jane Roberts, channeler for Seth. At that time I was spending a semester at the University of Harvard, in the U.S., doing research for my thesis. I had become thoroughly disenchanted with academic philosophy, as I mentioned before. I discovered the Seth books in a little bookstore nearby the university and soon got fascinated by this ‘forbidden fruit’ (forbidden by academic standards). I felt that these writings were both philosophically profound and very loving and inspiring. Reading these books deeply affected me. I now feel it was the universe’s - or my soul’s - way of waking me up and showing me a new direction in life. In the years after that, I read a lot of channeled books by other authors as well. But Seth made the most impact because it was all new to me at that time. Now, I hardly read anything anymore.
When did you come to ‘notice’ that Jeshua was with you and how would you describe his energy?
One evening in 2002, I was doing a personal session with my husband Gerrit, when I noticed a presence near me which I had not felt before. I was used to speaking with spiritual guides, who I often felt around me and who would uplift me with their loving suggestions and cheerfulness. These were personal guides. But when I felt Jeshua’s presence, it was different. It felt like a solemn and deeply aware energy, very grounded and focused, not like anything I met before. It frightened me a bit at first. I asked the energy ‘Who are you?’ and then I saw the name ‘Jeshua ben Joseph’ spelled out in front of my inner eye very clearly. I instantly felt it was true. My mind started to raise sceptical objections at once. But just before that, in a flash, my soul had recognized Jeshua as a very familiar presence. My mind argued it was extremely unlikely and presumptuous that he would be next to me in my sitting room. But my heart reassured me that it was quite normal for Jeshua to be so close to us.
Jeshua is not really an authority far and high above us. He means to be our friend, someone you can trust and be open to, as he never judges you. As I have come to know Jeshua, he is never judging me, although he is very direct and upfront. He asks of me to be really honest with myself, to look my fears in the eye, and not cover them up by self-serving theories or justifications.
So he is stern in a way, but it’s a very loving way. It makes you realize what love is about. Love does not necessarily feel nice and comforting. Often it asks of you to get out of your comfort zone, to be courageous and vulnerable.
For me, expressing myself publicly as a channel for Jeshua, raised a lot of fear and insecurity in me, which have been very hard to overcome. My instinct (or survival mechanism) has long been to withdraw from the world, which I considered to be a very scary place. Jeshua is teaching me to feel safe in the world, to remain centered and self-aware while connecting to people instead of fearful and fragmented. I’m still learning how to do this, but I think I made some progress. I have received so much because of that: through the Jeshua channelings, I have connected to my soul family across the word. People from all over the world have written me to tell me how touched they are by Jeshua’s messages. I feel more at home on Earth. And what’s most important: despite the fears, I sense the deep fulfilment of doing what my soul really longs to do on earth right now.
Your messages are very down to earth yet explain complex concepts so clearly. How do you receive the messages from Jeshua, do you ‘translate’ them in some way?
Indeed, the messages are quite clear and down to earth, despite the fact that they are highly metaphysical. I think this is due to a number of factors. First, as I know Jeshua, he is quite direct and clear in stating his messages. He doesn’t beat around the bush and he seeks to address our heart, not our intellect. This goes against my own nature a bit. I was trained as an academic philosopher and I used to write articles that were unreadable to ‘normal folk’, because they were so intellectually complex and abstract. Jeshua is definitely not in that business.
On the other hand, my philosophical training has also helped me develop the ability to break down complex concepts into simple words. In that way, it has proved to be very valuable in my work as a channeler. I think my own education as a philosopher also accounts for the way the Jeshua messages are stated. Thirdly, I sometimes feel that it’s simply a human expectation that spiritual teachers or ‘ascended masters’ (don’t care much for that phrase!) express themselves very stately and formally. It fits our image of a wise and revered teacher. Jeshua however seeks to be close to our hearts, and not create any distance.
By the way, I think that channeling always involves a kind of translation. Every channel has some influence on what comes through because of their upbringing, their culture, their specific interests and talents. Something I became thoroughly aware of while studying philosophy of science is that it is naïve to assume that we can ever perceive reality purely and untainted by subjective elements. The ideal of objective perception, perception that blocks out the perceiver altogether, has become deeply problematic, ever more so with the rise of quantum mechanics. Likewise, channelings are always filtered by the personality and cultural background of the channel. The best thing to deal with that is to be aware of this and, when you listen to channels, use your discernment and pick whatever resonates with you.
How would you describe your relationship with Jeshua during the channelling process?
When I sit down to channel, I go into a light trance. This means that I focus my attention within, let my body relax and become as quiet and silent as possible. I then feel Jeshua entering my energy field and often, I feel a little jolt down my spine as we connect. It takes a minute or so for our energies to meld and then I hear "Go ahead" within. I start speaking and I am aware of what I am saying, yet there’s a flow of energy pouring through me which ‘gives me’ the words so to speak. I feel enveloped by this very loving and compassionate flow and I feel lifted above my ordinary, daily consciousness. Often I sense great peace and I am aware that there is so much more meaning to life than we ordinarily feel and think. I also feel that the vast energy of love and compassion coming through me from ‘the other side’ is hard to put into words. The words often seem limiting to me as I channel.
My relationship to Jeshua during the channeling process is one of an active receiver I would say. On the one hand, I am as open as possible to whatever wants to come through. On the other hand I am active and alert, and I need to focus on getting the message across in human concepts and language. My mind needs to participate to make the translation, and I need to let that happen without interfering from the level of my personal will or belief systems.
This is a delicate process and I do not claim to be perfect at it. I am sure that in translating Jeshua’s energy into human speech, I am filtering the message somehow. The problem is that it’s very difficult for a human to know what filters are still in them. The most persistent filters are blind spots, presumptions you take for granted because you are not aware of them as such. I think the more we grow and open up to the true reality of love, we let go of our filters. This is a gradual process in my experience. Instead of mourning the fact that our perception is filtered, I think it’s much more joyful to look forward to dropping ever more filters on our way. Channeling is a human affair, but that’s okay. We are here to experience what it’s like to be human, and to revel in the awakenings we experience as humans.
I found the lightworkers series so helpful in putting into context my own experiences; did the material impact your own life and spiritual development?
Yes, it did. It was the first series of channelings I received from Jeshua. He said to me the messages in it were meant specifically for lightworkers. He said that they would be the first ones on Earth to embrace a new, heart-based consciousness. The material is meant to support them in their awakening, so that they can go out and be the teachers for the ones who follow.
For myself, this series made me understand better who I am and what it means to be a lightworker. I read many stories in books and on the Internet about lightworkers, and I felt deep resonance with it, but I never quite understood one thing. Lightworkers were said to have a mission to bring light and consciousness to Earth, they were said to be natural teachers and healers and to have sacrificed much to be here and do their work.
Lightworkers were very much ‘the good guys’. In fact, they almost seemed to be a kind of martyrs: always giving of themselves and carrying the world on their shoulders. It all sounded a bit too holy for me. I myself felt huge resistance to being on Earth, carrying a lot of old sadness and anger within. I wanted to know where that came from and what my purpose in life really was.
Jeshua’s story in the Lightworker Series reveals that we in fact played very dark parts also in earlier lifetimes, some of them in Atlantis and some in times before we incarnated on Earth. In that ancient era, we explored ego-based consciousness to the fullest. Getting to know and understand the dark parts of our/my history satisfied my sense of justice, my sense of balance. I also feel it gave me a healthy sense of humility.
What helped me also is that Jeshua stresses in the Lightworker series that we are not here to save the world. We are here primarily to heal ourselves, to face our dark side, to understand and treat our own emotional hurts with love and compassion. When we do so, we become ‘enlightened’ - we enter heart-based consciousness. We radiate a peaceful, loving energy to others, but this is not something we do (as in a job), it naturally happens because we are who we are. So, the notion of lightwork as ‘working hard to heal the world’ is misplaced according to Jeshua as I receive him. Lightwork is about you and not about the world, and it is a state of being rather than a doing. Realizing this has helped me let go of the urge to ‘save others’, which I think is a deeply ingrained habit of lightworkers. It has helped me to be more centered and focused within.
Jeshua takes great care to separate himself (his earth life as Jeshua) from Jesus as portrayed in the Bible, what would you say is the key difference between their portrayals?
I think the greatest difference is with his portrayal by Church tradition. In the Bible, there are authentic stories about what Jeshua did and said, of course related and interpreted by humans with their own cultural and psychological background. In the Church’s interpretation, Jeshua appears as a deified figure, being closer to and more like God than us.
To underline his special position, he is said to have died for our sins. Jeshua as he presents himself to me, wants us to know that we are as close to God as he is, that he was human as we are and that he died not to take away our sins, but simply because ruling authorities were opposed to him, like they have been opposed throughout history to freethinkers and teachers of the heart. Our sins need not be taken away by another. They are not sins to begin with, but more like areas of ignorance and fear which are part of the human experience. We are here to gracefully transcend them and enjoy the journey Home. We are granted to be fully human by Jeshua, and that’s at odds with much that has been taught by the Church.
Pamela, thank you very much for taking the time to speak with us today.
Pamela and Gerrit are married and have a spiritual practice in The Netherlands (Europe). They have been working with the energy of Jeshua since 2002. Pamela is channeller for Jeshua and Gerrit is regression therapist who always accompanies Pamela in the channelling sessions.
"For me, the name Jeshua refers not so much to the historical personality of Jesus but to the universal christ energy that we are all a part of. When I channel Jeshua, I feel deeply drawn into this field of love and compassion and in that state of consciousness I receive the messages from Jeshua."
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